Monday, May 14, 2007
Someone Explain This to Me
While looking around online for some information about education in Washington state, I found a co-op (a couple actually, but one to which I am referring) dedicated to secular homeschooling. That's cool, I like that we have a state that is friendly to homeschooling, and everyone has the right to do so here, (although, I kind of figured that the public schools were where you went to get a secular education, they certainly aren't getting a religious education there). What I found perplexing was that after making statements about not wanting any religious dialogue, being free from Christian homeschool programs especially, I scanned down and saw that they met weekly at - where do you think? - a church!
Yes, I understand it was probably a matter of needing a place they could use weekly for little or no money. That actually makes me think even less of them. Have the courage of your convictions, folks. If you are so affronted by religious, and especially Christian, influence and want a strictly secular educational system, at least don't use the church. As it is, they are selling out their own so-called values, and using a Christian church (no, it wasn't Unitarian), to promote exclusion of Christian thought and influence in education. If it's nefarious for kids to mention God in graduation speeches at public high schools, why is it innocuous to promote excising Christian teaching from homeschooling in a church?
I also wonder at a church permitting this group, whose purpose clearly states that they wish to keep Christian teaching, homeschool materials and influence out of their co-op and discussion, meet there.
Yes, I understand it was probably a matter of needing a place they could use weekly for little or no money. That actually makes me think even less of them. Have the courage of your convictions, folks. If you are so affronted by religious, and especially Christian, influence and want a strictly secular educational system, at least don't use the church. As it is, they are selling out their own so-called values, and using a Christian church (no, it wasn't Unitarian), to promote exclusion of Christian thought and influence in education. If it's nefarious for kids to mention God in graduation speeches at public high schools, why is it innocuous to promote excising Christian teaching from homeschooling in a church?
I also wonder at a church permitting this group, whose purpose clearly states that they wish to keep Christian teaching, homeschool materials and influence out of their co-op and discussion, meet there.
Labels: Culture and Politics
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I understand parents wanting to homeschool, I can't say that I find mass produced education in any country very appealing to anyone except that very average kid. And I can understand why someone who is not Christian not wanting to have those principals in their child's education. However, it does seem a bit hypocritical to make a pointed statment about how distasteful Christianity is, then ask to use their facilities, particularly when there are usually other readily available community resources for meetings.
I would also like to say, that your comments on motherhood from your previous post are wonderful.
Ever since college I have admired your personality. You have a great sense of humour, strong convictions in your beliefs and the ability to find joy in rolling with the punches! Plus you are so organized! I find you an inspiration and am glad to have you as a friend. May you and your family continue to be blessed with health, happiness and all good things!
Love,
Alina
I would also like to say, that your comments on motherhood from your previous post are wonderful.
Ever since college I have admired your personality. You have a great sense of humour, strong convictions in your beliefs and the ability to find joy in rolling with the punches! Plus you are so organized! I find you an inspiration and am glad to have you as a friend. May you and your family continue to be blessed with health, happiness and all good things!
Love,
Alina
Thank you Alina! Trust me, I'm not as organized as I look, some days are better than others, and I still have mountains of laundry and dishes everyday.
That was the thing, I completely get wanting to homeschool, and I understand wanting to have a non-Christian education for one's children, but they seemed to have a bit more than a desire to have a non-Christian education. They seemed hostile to any religious influence, so it struck me as hypocritical and chintzy to use a church facility.
I didn't know you were reading here. :) You know I read your blog, it's how I keep up with your life. I don't know how you keep up with your life, so we're even on that score.
I read about your moving change. I hope Jerusalem works out, being close to everything will help, even if it isn't exactly what you had planned.
That was the thing, I completely get wanting to homeschool, and I understand wanting to have a non-Christian education for one's children, but they seemed to have a bit more than a desire to have a non-Christian education. They seemed hostile to any religious influence, so it struck me as hypocritical and chintzy to use a church facility.
I didn't know you were reading here. :) You know I read your blog, it's how I keep up with your life. I don't know how you keep up with your life, so we're even on that score.
I read about your moving change. I hope Jerusalem works out, being close to everything will help, even if it isn't exactly what you had planned.
Wow! That is pretty weird.
I specifically avoid any homeschool events that meet in churches...even the curriculum fairs.
There must be 10 other places to meet that wouldn't cost a dime...the library?
I specifically avoid any homeschool events that meet in churches...even the curriculum fairs.
There must be 10 other places to meet that wouldn't cost a dime...the library?
It's not that hard to understand. We're in a secular group. That group includes everything from Christians to pagans to atheists. Being secular doesn't mean that we're anti-Christian. It just means that the purpose of the group is not to further (or impede) any particular religion. So we avoid all discussion of religion and are able to include everyone.
Daryl,
First off welcome to my blog. I don't believe I've ever seen you post before
Second, I think you're reading a personal criticism where there is none. Unless you are part of this group I mentioned, which specifically stated that they wished to have no Christian texts, influences, discussion, etc. That is what makes this baffling. It wasn't just some happy, freewheeling, non-sectarian group, it was a group that was not only specifically non-religious, but specifically wanted to eliminate all traces of Christianity from their midst. It was beyond hypocritical for them to then use a church facility for their group. It is even more bizarro that the church allowed them to do so.
There were several secular groups as you describe out there, those that were made up of people from different or no religious background, but this was not one of them. I also found other groups that were pretty much anti-Christian, but they at least had the conviction not to take advantage of church facilities.
First off welcome to my blog. I don't believe I've ever seen you post before
Second, I think you're reading a personal criticism where there is none. Unless you are part of this group I mentioned, which specifically stated that they wished to have no Christian texts, influences, discussion, etc. That is what makes this baffling. It wasn't just some happy, freewheeling, non-sectarian group, it was a group that was not only specifically non-religious, but specifically wanted to eliminate all traces of Christianity from their midst. It was beyond hypocritical for them to then use a church facility for their group. It is even more bizarro that the church allowed them to do so.
There were several secular groups as you describe out there, those that were made up of people from different or no religious background, but this was not one of them. I also found other groups that were pretty much anti-Christian, but they at least had the conviction not to take advantage of church facilities.
A big shrug from me.
I think it's great that they feel welcome to meet in a church and that the church welcomes them.
As for whether they're anti-christian, that's not a judgement I'm willing to make. Not discussing christianty doesn't make one anti-christian and the fact that they use a church might challenge your assumption.
I wish them well.
I think it's great that they feel welcome to meet in a church and that the church welcomes them.
As for whether they're anti-christian, that's not a judgement I'm willing to make. Not discussing christianty doesn't make one anti-christian and the fact that they use a church might challenge your assumption.
I wish them well.
Dawn,
My assumption was not based on their being secular or non-Christian. It was based on their words. They opened asking if the reader was also sick of the Christianity prevalent in homeschooling groups and proceeded to list their rules to make sure that no Christianity, Christian teaching, curriculum, discussion or influence would be welcome or tolerated. Yet they use a church building for their meeting.
You may not feel able to make the judgement, but reading their pitch, I am. There were other non-Christian, and non-religious groups I found, as I said, who also were not tolerant to Christianity, but they had the decency to be consistent and not just use the church when it was convenient, all the while condemning it.
There are only two reasons I can see for a church to open its doors to this kind of group, let me clarify, to an anti-Christian group rather than merely a non-Christian group wishing to use the faciilities. One reason would be because the church saw an opportunity to witness Christian charity to them in the hope that the hearts in the group might be changed. The other is that the church itself is not so much Christian as universalist and thinks that all belief is equivalent, and so don't care that the group's premise begins with trashing Christianity (along with other religious groups, but they specifically named Christianity).
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My assumption was not based on their being secular or non-Christian. It was based on their words. They opened asking if the reader was also sick of the Christianity prevalent in homeschooling groups and proceeded to list their rules to make sure that no Christianity, Christian teaching, curriculum, discussion or influence would be welcome or tolerated. Yet they use a church building for their meeting.
You may not feel able to make the judgement, but reading their pitch, I am. There were other non-Christian, and non-religious groups I found, as I said, who also were not tolerant to Christianity, but they had the decency to be consistent and not just use the church when it was convenient, all the while condemning it.
There are only two reasons I can see for a church to open its doors to this kind of group, let me clarify, to an anti-Christian group rather than merely a non-Christian group wishing to use the faciilities. One reason would be because the church saw an opportunity to witness Christian charity to them in the hope that the hearts in the group might be changed. The other is that the church itself is not so much Christian as universalist and thinks that all belief is equivalent, and so don't care that the group's premise begins with trashing Christianity (along with other religious groups, but they specifically named Christianity).
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